Benchrest in Canada
BR Discussions => Centerfire Discussions => Topic started by: DSIMON on March 30, 2010, 04:50:22 PM
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I had posted earlier on about waiting patiently for my 6ppc to be
ready at the gunsmiths and was asking lots of questions about loading for this round
and many of you graciously answered.
I received rifle a few weeks ago and I'm almost up and running.
I needed a bore guide and spoke with Mike Lucas,but he wouldn,t have a run ready till mid April.
Next step was to speak with TK Nolan.
No problem was his reply.I'll make you one up today and ship it out today.
Just send me the money.
"I trust you" he says.
Now I know the TK Nolan bore saver is a chunk of change,but you only live once
and when it arrived,I was very impressed.
TK is 71 and a little hard of hearing,but he's a pleasure to deal with and will talk as long as you have the time.
Next up,sent Walter Harrell some fired cases.
I should have die next week.
Walter is the same as TK.
A voice with a drawl and all the time in the world to talk.
I got 5 lbs. of N133 from Higginsons and a bucket of bullets from
Bill Mitchell,a custom bullet maker,not too far from my home.
I got a Wilson seater from Sinclair.
I've fireformed some of my brass and this weekend will start some actual testing of this rig.
It's going to be a nice warm weekend in Ontario...Yahoo!!!
I've got a lot to learn.
Thanks all for your advice and especially Calvin who took the time to
help me figure out how to load for the 6ppc and also how to identify various genres of the Wasp species.
Here's a pic of Lil Red.
(http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j196/Bluecolt/DSC00675.jpg)
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Congratulations
One year ago I was at the same point in my evolution as you are now. Brand new rifle, I'll be shooting bug holes in no time. I was wrong. There is a learning curve. I struggled from April until the end of July before it "clicked". There's learning how to tune a 6ppc. At the same time as learning how to shoot a 10 1/2 pound rifle. Its not forgiving like my HV. You could do almost anything behind the HV and it would still agg .299. Then there's learning the bag set up, not making shooter errors. The LV is so much more sensitive and requires more finesse. Then there's learning the wind flags. When I was really struggling I turned to my barrel maker Ted and my gunsmith Lyle for advice. That's when it all came together. Its a trip.
Enjoy your new gun because when it all comes together you will be smiling.
Dwayne
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Dwayne,
Thanks for the great reply.
It's going to be a fun summer shooting this rig.
I've already braced myself for possibly shooting badly for a while..lol.
Did you hit a point where maybe you thought you sunk all this money into a rig ,that was a dog.
After I did my first fireforming,a buddy asked me how the rifle shot.
I told him that the Weaver wouldn,t hold zero,the barrel was bad,the gunsmithing
was second rate,the stock didn,t track well,the wind was blowing too hard,I needed a better rest,and on and on.
It couldn,t have been me.
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No it wasn't like that.
I knew how small I wanted the groups to be and I had a hard time reaching that level. In August I shot my first screamer in competition, a.091. It didn't come automatically, I had to work at it. Call it paying my dues.
That is a beautiful looking rifle.
Dwayne
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well aboard dsimon. this is a great sport. you said bill mitchell is not to far from you. i live in fergus. bill is a great guy if you get in a hold of bill he can let you know when our shoots are in listowel and elmira hope to see you at the ranges suitty
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The Listowel and Elmira shoots dates are listed on this site.
Gary
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Just when you almost think your a natural , along comes the cactus classic & your extreamly ordinary.
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A natural, if mine does not STOP SHOOTING GLOBS, it will become my trap gun or will be up for sale with all the other cra++++++++.
Why can I never get a day when the wind is NOT HOWLING.
This game is frustrating.
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Cal
The venom level in your bloodstream has dropped. You need to get stung. Quick find yourself a nest.
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DSIMON
Are you shooting your new gun yet? How is it coming? Are you experiencing the trials tribulations and frustrations of tuning your first 6ppc by yourself or are you fortunate enough to have a mentor shorten up the process?
How about an update?
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Dwayne I talked with him last week and he is having some issues with the bullets and his necks. I tried to help him out but it is pretty tough to figure out without seeing his relaoding procedures.
Derek says that if he tries to seat the bullets to the just kissing the lands point they become REAL loose in the neck. It is almost as if he hits a wall when seating the bullets. If he pushes them past that wall where he needs to, he says he can push the bullets in and out with little force. As if there is a donut in the neck. He says the bushing is sizing the neck right to the shoulder neck junction.
He was going to try and take a run to Rob McClennan and figure it out. Rob shoots the same chamber as him.
Calvin
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Sounds like an issue of taking accurate measurements and choosing the right bushing. I could barely afford the gun and didn't have proper measuring tools until last month. Before that I had to take stuff over to Phil to be measured properly.
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Accurate measuring tools ? This is going to get interesting boys
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Get a .001 smaller bushing in that die and the problem will likely go away. I've had some barrels that like that type of set up. Sure makes it easier if they do. t doesn't matter then where they are from the lands, just seat em and then pull them out till they get snug! Slows you down though cause you are always worried about a powder spill in the action!
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DSIMON
Are you shooting your new gun yet? How is it coming? Are you experiencing the trials tribulations and frustrations of tuning your first 6ppc by yourself or are you fortunate enough to have a mentor shorten up the process?
How about an update?
I'm learning by myself Dwayne.
It would be nice to have a mentor,but I'm walking this one alone at the moment.
I have been frustrated.
As Calvin stated,I was having a hard time seating the bullets to a proper depth.
I am using 68gr. FB custom bullets.
I have shot some of these and the groups are decent.
Then again,as a beginner I am part of the decent equation.
I have loaded for 223 and 6mmbr factory guns and never had a problem.
I now have come to learn my 6ppc chamber is cut as a short chamber and works properly with BT bullets.
Upon discovering this I took a BT bullet and presto,problem solved.
I can load a BT to any OAL..deep...long...it doesn,t matter.
The neck will hold proper tension and I can seat the bullet any where I choose.
Am I pleased in making this discovery.
Not really.
It was a lot of uneccessary trial and error
But I'm a newb and didn,t know better when having this rifle built.
I definitely know better now.
Hello Lester..yes I'd like to try some of your 68gr.BT bullets.
You seem to do well with them.
What? You'd like to build me a 6ppc to my specifications.
Let's talk.
Derrick
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Good to see you can still chuckle after the ordeal Derek.
Like Dwayne says when it all begins to come together it is fun to shoot. Don't get discouraged and remember about the SS.......... ;)
Later,
Calvin
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Good to see you can still chuckle after the ordeal Derek.
Like Dwayne says when it all begins to come together it is fun to shoot. Don't get discouraged and remember about the SS.......... ;)
Later,
Calvin
For a moment you lost me on the SS reference.
I can see it now,me and Lester sitting down,,chewing the 6ppc fat.
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I'm missing something here a flat base has a pressure ring and a BT is being held with the same neck,bush & loading proceedure?
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You are right.
Derek told me when he talked with Rob McClennan that the reamer his chamber was cut with was desinged to be used with Boat Tail bullets. So what was happening to seat his bullets to where they were just kisisng the lands he had to seat the bullets so deep that the base of the FB bullets must have had to go past the neck shoulder junction. Once that happened (because ofthe pressuer ring) neck tension was lost.
Using BT bullets there is no pressure ring so it is a non issue.
I never thought there could be a reamer throated that short where a 68 gr bullet would go past that junction.
I told himhe should get the throat opened with a throater but he just wants to shoot the D+++ thing.
He was getting frustrated. It is not fun when you have something and cannot make it work.
He knows what the issue is so know just to get some Bruno 00 boat tails.........
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Could go with a shorter bullet, 63-66 FB on the shorter jacket. Maybe Dan O has something on the short jackets he can try. Dan you out there?
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Actually dan does have the 64.5 grain. I believe it is on the 790 jacket.
It may be worth a try................
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Thanks Rick and Calvin for the advice on the shorter bullets.
I'll look into that.
Does Dan have a contact number or email?
In a trying sort of way I am thrust into a lot of rifle education.
Bullet length, different ogives,J4 jackets,pressure rings,etc. etc. etc.
It's all new to me.
It's all good.
I've never learned anything the easy way..lol
Derrick
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Derek e-mail your way...
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I had this issue with my gun when I first had a barrel done by Joe. The reamer is sort of a mix of Clayton Martin and Joe Kroetsch's idea of all the best features of a 6ppc reamer. The short throat was to get as much barrel life as possible without setting a barrel back and so that you could use the newer double ojive bullets that Bart and Bruno were starting to make at the time. At the time I was neck sizing with a Wilson inline and when you seated a 7 or 8 ojive bullet it would pop past the sized part of the neck and the bullet would rest on the powder. The way I fixed it was to have the die shortened 60 thou or more and the chamber reamed the same amount deeper so that in the end the die will size down a little farther on the neck and the problem stopped. Everything was working good after that.
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John you hit the nail on the head with the issue Derek is having.
That IS the ISSUE....... Well the problem is sort of solved......
Calvin
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Well Calvin..we got the answer.
I'm laughing..but just because,it proves I did not totally lose my mind
thinking that I was the the only man on the planet who couldn,t figure out why he couldn,t seat a bullet properly..
Thanks John for taking the time to set me straight on this.
There's a new one....a double ogive bullet...Jesus.
Yes,with the Wilson neck sizer you only can size half the neck.
It took me a few pulled bullets till I caught on.
I borrowed a friends Redding competition neck sizing die and that sized the whole neck.
The bullet still kept popping down,but I didn,t realize it was the powder it was bottoming out on.
I thought that maybe it was a doughnut.
I just received a Harrells die and it sizes more of the neck than the Wilson.
At the moment,I'm going to shoot this rifle without any further work on it.
I'll report back with my 6ppc Adventure..Part 3
Derrick